BOOK 7 - Let the Speculation Begin *Spoilers*

[Guest]

[Bitsy]

Yep I agree, it did seem like Hagrid will soon be an ex-half giant.  Unless of course JKR knew we would think that if she hesitated and it was a red herring 

As for Petunia, I had forgotten about Azkaban.  OK totally wild theory time now .... maybe she did something when she was younger that meant she was due to be sent to Azkaban ie tried to assassinate a senior wizard or burn down Hogwarts.  OK these might be a bit extreme but it is feasible she tried to expose the wizarding community in order to destroy them.  She may have been sentenced to a term in Azkaban (we have never been told a Muggle can't be sent there) and Dumbledore was the one who came to her rescue thus owing him a debt of honour/gratitude.

Well this may seem completely crazy but could just be ......

Sharon, you may be on to something. Remember her reaction when she found out they were dementors who attacked Dudley?  She gasped and was terrified.  To go along with your theory, could it be that she was a Squib?  Remember how she said, "Our parents were so proud. 'We have a witch in the family. Isn't it wonderful?'" Maybe she did then do someting bad because she wanted the glory Lily had.  Then when Dumbledore saved her, she being in his debt, she worked feverishly to hide that part of her life, not only from Muggles, but also other wizards.  Isn't being a Squib something you wouldn't want other wizards to know?  I think JKR said Petunia was not a wizard...well, being a Squib is NOT a wizard?!  Possible? 

[Morningangel-Iola]

Yes but don't you have to have wizard parents to be a squib otherwise you are just a muggle 

[Bitsy]

Yes but don't you have to have wizard parents to be a squib otherwise you are just a muggle 

I dunno, that's a good point. Hermione's parents are Muggles and she's a wizard.  But to be a Squib...oh, man, I am going to have to look some stuff up now.    Err I don't really want to wait nearly a year to find out everything.   .  Well, it's less than a year now! I'm grasping for straws here. 

[Nienna]

I thought squibs were only born to wizard parents?
I'm sure I've read somewhere that JKR stated that Petunia is not a squib either - Lily's family were ALL muggles and that includes her sister Petunia.
What's to say that Petunia and Lily are half-sisters?
Perhaps their mother re-married or had an affair and became pregnant - which could account for how very different the two sisters are from each other?
James Potter was from an all-wizard family and from what I recall, he wasn't related to Sirius Black either.
The reason I mention them was that much was made of who linked with who in OotP and I'm certain attention would have been drawn to the fact of Sirius and James being related no matter how distantly, wouldn't you agree?

I think it's quite likely that Lily's parent might have had a subscription to the Daily Prophet too (much like Hermione does in the books and because they were so proud of Lily and wanted to know about the magical world) and if that's true, then I'm sure Petunia would have sneaked a read of it when her parents weren't looking which would account for why she knew so much about dementors and Azkaban.

Just my ten penn'orth .. 

[kbmum]

James and Sirius might be related.  Here's a thread about the Black family tree.  There was a Dorea in the Black/Nigellus family who married Charlus Potter, and they had one son.  The son could be James.  JK said that James' parents were older when they had him, they died sometime before Harry was born, and James was an only child.

http://www.theyakshack.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=4092.0

I think Petunia told Harry that she heard "that awful boy" (or something like that) telling Lilly about dementors and Azkaban.

[Bitsy]

Ok, I looked it up.  You are right.  A Squib is born to a wizarding family.  I guess I'm trying too hard to figure everything out! Ugh, this is vexing.   

[allender]

My theories on Petunia are based on the passages where we heard about Lily visiting, and her reactions to (paraphrasing) "that horrid boy". Many folks assume this meant James, but Lily and Severus worked together a lot too, so the reference might well be to Snape ... and potentially Petunia and Snape had a "thing" going, or he left some item with her that will turn out to be important. Jo says that Petunia's not a squib, but hasn't (I don't think) completely ruled out that she might have latent magic -- there's supposed to be a character who discovers magic late in life, and I don't think that person has been identified definitively.

[Morningangel-Iola]

NO I am pretty sure she said she wouldn't show any magic.

[allender]

Okay then, if the statement was dead clear. Then I still favor a Petunia-Snape connection from when he made a summer visit home with Lily.

Book 6 destroyed the idea that Snape may have been a long-lost sibling ... but Severus Snape is still an anagram for Perseus Evans. (Likely Jo planted that tidbit early, with the possibility of doing something with it later, and then discarded the idea.)

[Sharon]

I like the idea of Petunia not referring to James in 'that horrid boy' quote.  So if it isn't James and for a minute lets assume it isn't Severus, how about Sirius?  He was a bit of a hunk in his youth and Petunia could have fallen for him and been rejected - for some reason I think it far more likely that Petunia had met Sirius than Severus.

So if we are getting totally outrageous here why not assume she had met Peter?  Maybe she had something to do with him finding the Potters and therefore was connected, unintentionally, to their death.  Yes Peter was the secret keeper but who is to say that Lily hadn't also made Petunia privy to the secret as well?  She was her sister and although Petunia didn't like Lily we don't actually know that Lily didn't like Petunia. 

Do we know who cast the spell to keep the Potters hidden?  Was it the Potters themselves or Dumbledore?

[kbmum]

We don't know who cast the Fidelius Charm.  It could have been Lilly, James, Sirius, or Peter.  It couldn't have been Dumbledore, because the person who cast it had to be the one to name Pettigrew as the secret-keeper.  Or, maybe someone else cast the spell.   For a while, I thought it might be Hagrid, since he arrived at Godric's Hollow before Sirius, but then he would have known Peter was the secret-keeper.  That begs the question -- how did Hagrid know to go to Godric's Hollow the night the Potters died?

[Nienna]

I think the Fidelius Charm is cast by those who wish to be hidden - Lily & James - and I also think that Peter would have had to have been there at the casting of it to be named secret keeper.

What's the betting Dumbledore sent Hagrid to Godric's Hollow?
Perhaps Lily & James were due to meet with someone from the Order and didn't show for their meeting. Or maybe Dumbledore had a tip-off that Voldie was preparing an attack and sent Hagrid round to warn them of it?

[Sharon]

But even if Lily and James were AWOL and Dumbledore had sent Hagrid to look for them he wouldn't have known where the Potters were hiding - as Cindy says Dumbledore didn't know Peter was the secret keeper and since only Peter could have passed on the secret we must assume Albus didn't know where the Potters were. 

This has bugged me since we found out exactly how the Fidelius Charm worked - how did Hagrid and Sirius find the Potters?  At first I thought maybe they had seen it on the Muggle news but they got there before the police so this can't be the case.  Then I thought maybe when the people concerned died the charm became null and void but JKR has said this isn't the case, a secret stays secret.  Ahhhh it hurts my head to think about it .  It is like time travel, cause and effect 

But this has given me lots more to think about and the more I consider things the more I am convinced Petunia took Harry in out of guilt and/or a debt to Dumbledore 

[Morningangel-Iola]

Not sure about Hargird but couldn't peter have told Sirius where they were as he couldn't pass it on.

[Sharon]

Well he could have done - Sirius did know Peter was the secret keeper but for some unknown reason I don't think he did.  Why would Peter have told Sirius where the Potters were?  That would have defeated the object of the charm.  And he couldn't have done it after the deaths - Sirius didn't find Peter until sometime the next day.  Soooooo confusing 

[Morningangel-Iola]

How would i defeat the object of the charm Sirius couldn't pass it on, its impossible. Or did he say he didn't want to know at the time 

[Sharon]

Well I just figure if someone is going to cast one of the hardest and most complicated charms in existence they wouldn't then tell other people willy nilly where they were.  Maybe I am just making things up as I go along but the way I see it Peter was the only person who could have told anyone where the Potters were - even the Potters couldn't have done that (unless they asked Peter to do it).  As Peter wanted the Potters as helpless as possible he wouldn't want any magical folk to know their whereabouts.  Of course this blows my theory about Petunia knowing where they were 

[kbmum]

Peter had to have told Sirius the secret.  In the Shrieking Shack, Sirius told Harry that the night James and Lilly died, he went to check on Peter, who was preparing to go into hiding.  He arrived at Peter's home and knew something wasn't right, so he set off for the Potters' house.  Besides, telling Sirius the secret wouldn't matter, since he would not have been able to reveal the secret to anyone under any circumstances.

[Morningangel-Iola]

Yes thats it beccause even though they know it they can't tell anyone only the secret keeper could. But how come Hagrid know where to go had Peter told him too 

[kbmum]

That's the question.  Hagrid would have known that Peter was the secret-keeper if Peter had revealed the secret to him.