BOOK 7 - Let the Speculation Begin *Spoilers*

[Guest]

[Bitsy]

I'm hoping that it will in some way keep Harry alive.  And I agree completely that it will tie in with the protection his mother gave him...something having to do with the one thing Voldemort has never and will never comprehend: love.

I've heard some theories that Harry himself may be a Horocrux.  I kind of don't think he is...but, if he is, maybe he will have to "die" to kill Voldemort, then once Voldemort is dead, Harry will be revived somehow because of the blood factor. I don't really know, I'm just desperate to find a way to keep Harry breathing! 

[Morningangel-Iola]

I have a strong feeling Harry is a horcrux because he has a connection with Voldemort, I think it happened by accident. Anyway thats what worries me about Harrys fate that he may need to die.

[Bitsy]

I have a strong feeling Harry is a horcrux because he has a connection with Voldemort, I think it happened by accident. Anyway thats what worries me about Harrys fate that he may need to die.

What's confusing to me is the prophecy and the explanation Dumbledore gives Harry in HBP.  I thought that Harry had to destroy all the Horcruxs in order to make Voldemort mortal...then Harry would have a chance to kill him, but couldn't do that until he was on an even playing field.  I thought the prophecy meant that one could not live while the other is living, so if Harry is a Horocrux and died before Voldemort becomes mortal, who would then fight him? Ron or Hermione, maybe?

I'm probably reading too much into this...I am so wanting to convince myself that Harry will survive.

[Morningangel-Iola]

It said one cannot live while the other survives, if memory serves me right. Well Voldy isn't really living so I would say that would put him in the surving catorgory. So can Harry only properly live when Voldy is dead? I hope so, Harry living is definately good.

[Sharon]

I am trying to get through all the books again before July and am currently in the middle of POA.  I have noticed something that is bugging me, see what you think -

When Harry is near a Dementor he hears his mum pleading with Voldy for Harry's life.  He says something like get out of my way you silly girl and Lilly comes back with no, not Harry.  Now why was the most evil and powerful wizard of all time negotiating with Lilly Potter  .  I always had the impression that one wave of Voldemort's wand and you were dead (maybe with a little duelling in between).  Presumably Voldemort had just killed James and headed up to the nursery to finish off Harry.  Why didn't he just zap Lilly?  Why did she beg for Harry's life instead of either fighting Voldemort to buy them some time or apparate out of there?  We now know that you can apparate with someone so Lilly could have done that.  If Lilly had stepped aside and allowed Voldy to kill Harry would he have let her live?

I know I am reading too much into this but I am now getting the distinct impression that Lilly knew Voldemort, and not just his reputation.  Either that or the memory Harry has isn't of Lilly pleading with Voldemort but with someone else in the room.

[mcgonagall]

or  she was doing the spell to protect harry and was buying some time to get it finished   also she would have know  about voldermort and  knew that in the end it would be usless to hide  so  in dying to save her son she was giving the  strongest  protection she knew and  if  you read on about how harry  had to  go to the dursleys every year  and the fact that dumbledore knew this i would say that  the spell was the backup play that they had made before the potters went into hiding . but  then i am only guessing  but let me know what you think

[kbmum]

Ever since we found out about side-along apparition, it's bugged me that Lily didn't do that with Harry.  The only theory I could come up with was that like Hogwarts, the house was protected with spells so that no one could apparate in or out.  Fred and George apparated inside Grimmauld Place, yet when James saw Voldemort and told Lily to get Harry and go, she ran up the stairs instead of apparated to Harry's room.  And yes, Voldemort has no problem killing anyone who steps in his way, so there was no need for him to negotiate with Lily.  Perhaps the scene just shows off JK's theatrical flair!

[Bitsy]

Sharon, I am so glad you brought this up! I have been bothered for so long that Voldemort told Lily to get out of the way--would he truly have let Lily live? And if so, why? I think there is much, much more to Lily than meets the eye...and possibly Voldemort. I mean, he's the type of character that wouldn't waste his breath or time asking Lily to move out of the way...he'd just kill her.

 It does make sense that Lily would negotiate with Voldemort to buy time, but it's still very odd that he seemed willing to let her live. I mean, he killed James with no problem. 

Yeah, I think it is likely that since the house was under magical protection, no one could apparate in or out. BUT, like Cindy said, why wouldn't she apparate WITHIN the house? Wouldn't she have been able to get to Harry quicker? And even if the house was under said protection, could it not have been broken by the house owners in the case of an emergency? You would think they would have that kind of loophole so they could escape if need be.

JK Rowling is a brilliant writer...no doubt about it! 

[Morningangel-Iola]

Well Voldy didn't apparate in, he walked so there probably was protection with that in mind.

[Sharon]

or  she was doing the spell to protect harry and was buying some time to get it finished   

Now that is something I hadn't considered Marcia - that the protection around Harry was an actual spell.  I had always assumed it was just the act of Lilly dying that had saved Harry but if it was a conscious spell Lilly cast that does change things quite a bit.

[mcgonagall]

i have another thought if james and lily thought they would survive then why was the key to there vault with  hagrid/Dumbledore

that  is what  has made  me believe that  dumbledore and  james and lily had a back up plan  and  the spell was part of it

[Bitsy]

You are right.  Clearly there was some fear that something could go wrong. I always thought that it was the act of Lily sacrificing her life for Harry that created the protection, but perhaps it is an actual spell.

I was also thinking, during one of my attempts at figuring out a way to save Harry, didn't JK once say that Harry is like a son to her? Well, would she really want to see a character she views like a son die? So, maybe Harry lives! Hurray! (I'll find any way for him to survive and live a nice life playing professional Quidditch or something).

[mcgonagall]

i do have a question for everyone   was dumbledore a teacher or a headmaster when  lily and james where at the school?

[kbmum]

I'm pretty sure he was the headmaster.  He was a teacher when Riddle was in school.

[ferdinand_the_yak]

I'd always assumed he was, in Philosopher's Stone, when Hagrid tells Harry about them in the shack, he said that Voldemort thought James and Lily were too close to Dumbledore to be turned to the dark side, and also that Voldemort would never have tried to take over Hogwarts at that time because he feared Dumbledore. In my opinion, this suggests that Dumbledore was Headmaster.

[mcgonagall]

 the  only reason i ask is because student often have a better  relationship with teachers than they do with headmasters and i wanted try try and figure out  if  the potters where at hogwarts around the same time as tom riddle ?? also  i was wondering if the potter where going into hiding why didn't james take the invisibilty cloak with him that would have surely  saved lily  and harry  but like the key to the  vault he left it with dumbledore for safe keeping

[kbmum]

The Harry Potter Lexicon lists Riddle's birth year as circa 1926, while James and Lily are circa 1958 or 1959 (but could be as early as 1957).

[Sharon]

I don't think the invisibility cloak would have been much help in the event of a major attack.  Whilst Voldemort wouldn't have been able to see them he still would have been able to destroy the house and the Potters along with it.  In fact that would have been a far better plan in hindsight for Voldemort.

But that does raise another question similar to the vault key - why did James leave the cloak with Dumbledore.  It also brings me full circle to my suspicions that DD isn't quite as nice as we thought he was.  What if he suggested that certain items were left with him as he 'knew' the Potters would die.  It has been suggested that DD did have an uncanny knowledge of future events.  Well what if one of them was the death of Lilly and James.  If he had foreseen that, he may have known that Harry would be the downfall of Voldemort and so wouldn't have wanted to stop it.

[Morningangel-Iola]

The cloak might have hidden them but remember Voldy is very good with the mind thingy so probably should have picked them up.

I think the Potters were still young when they had Harry.

[ferdinand_the_yak]

Apart from the Lexicon DOB details, in CoS, the Riddle Diary is backdated to 50 years prior, so Tom would have been 14-15, making the Potters at least 65 if that were true, which is impossible. Also, according to Hagrid in PS, Voldemort killed Lily and James at the height of his power, which (from the top of my head as I don't have a copy of the book on hand) was several years after he left school.